.30-30 Collet Die

[mr surveyor]

I have been looking, but it seems the only way to buy the "neck size only" die for .30-30 from Lee is to buy a three die set. Is that it, or can you buy the collet die alone? Does the collet die also expand and smooth out the inside of the neck?

I have a universal decapping die if needed, and would use the seating die from my 2-die RCBS set for seating and crimping, if the neck sizing proves sufficient for neck tension with a crimp.

I had 10 pieces of brass from last weeks load testing that had been decapped and run through the ultrasonic bath and dropped them all into the chamber, one by one, to check for any cycling issues. All slid right in the old 336 chamber. So, if the Lee Collet die will properly neck size the .30-30 brass, and the RCBS die will seat and crimp, I would like to give it a try.

Thutty-Thutty neck size die .... available by itself?


surv

[mr surveyor]

I just downloaded the "instruction sheet" for the collet die set and answered my question about the mandrel in the collet die.

I suppose the full meal deal with the collet sizing die, bullet seating die and a FCD would be the ticket for managing my own "used" brass, and save the RCBS dies for full length sizing of pick-up and "gimme" brass.

Always trying to learn


surv

[Maximumbob54]

I'm sure if you call Lee and order it direct then you could get it by itself but I've not seen it for sale not in a package deal. It's worth it though. I use one for my .308 loads and let me just say WOW.

[Ranch Dog]

Been kind of juggling admin duties with the user fun so a bit slow on posting. As a levergun nut, the only true bottleneck cartridge I'm shooting is the 35 Remington. When you push this cartridge in a strong levergun like the Marlin and use full length sizing to aid cartridge cycle, brass life can be short. I actually bought a 35 Lee Collet Die on ebay years ago for $5 and started to use this die for sizing my brass. So far, I have not run into any cartridge feed issues with the leveraction but I do not shoot a lot of 35 Rem.

Lee does not offer the Dead Length Bullet Seating Die as a stand alone die, so this morning I got off my rear end and ordered the various parts that make up the die. After all these year, it is about time. I also see this forum will end up costing me a bit of money as I bought the two Collet die set for the 30-30 Win. Might as well try them

[Rooster59]

Well, this conversation has gotten me to thinking. I have only one 30-30 rifle and have been full length sizing all my brass. I have thought about neck sizing only but don't really know how. Before I start that should I just step right into the collet die instead? What's the difference in using the collet die versus neck sizing in the standard die? Or can neck sizing even be done with the std die?

[Ranch Dog]

My 30-30 Collet dies arrived yesterday so I gave them a test load today using the brass previously fired in my Rossi Rio Grande chambered in 30-30 Win. No problem with the setup, die down solid against the shell holder with one additional turn tighter. The case sized against the ram stroke as explained in the instructions. I trimmed it with a Lee case trimmer and then chamfered & deburred it. With the accompanying Dead Length Bullet Seating Die, there was no issue seating my TLC311-165-RF. No shaved lead, plenty of case neck tension.

Using a Sinclair Bullet Runout Scale, the runout was less than .0005"! On some of the test cases I applied the Factory Crimp as I'm concerned with bullet movement in the magazine tube and the runout was still less than .0005".

The case seats without issue. It is snug in the final bit of lever movement but the bolt solidly locks without effort. Will load some and shoot them as soon as I can.

[Maximumbob54]

I would be curious to also see if it can not only be done but can continue to be done or if cases start to stick in chambers or not seat all the way.

[Ranch Dog]

I would be curious to also see if it can not only be done but can continue to be done or if cases start to stick in chambers or not seat all the way.

I'm going to find out Bob, ended up with a Doc's appointment everyday this week to look at my elbow that has been giving me fits so with chores I didn't get the time to shoot the rifle. It is time to do some load work/press trace testing with the RG3030 across all the appropriate Hodgdon powders I have on hand for the 30-30 Win, eight of them. So this should put some repetitive cycling on the brass through the collet die. I really like that on the first set of cartridges I did not need to expand the case mouth to get the C311-170-RF sized at .310 to seat. I am using a very light Factory Crimp, as light as I can make contact and feel resistance.

[Maximumbob54]

I would be curious to also see if it can not only be done but can continue to be done or if cases start to stick in chambers or not seat all the way.

I'm going to find out Bob, ended up with a Doc's appointment everyday this week to look at my elbow that has been giving me fits so with chores I didn't get the time to shoot the rifle. It is time to do some load work/press trace testing with the RG3030 across all the appropriate Hodgdon powders I have on hand for the 30-30 Win, eight of them. So this should put some repetitive cycling on the brass through the collet die. I really like that on the first set of cartridges I did not need to expand the case mouth to get the C311-170-RF sized at .310 to seat. I am using a very light Factory Crimp, as light as I can make contact and feel resistance.

I've had to use a universal expander with all my rifle cast bullets or they shave. I should try this with the collet sizer as I have one for 8mm but still just automatic use the expander next expecting to need it.

[Ranch Dog]

I'm going to find out Bob, ended up with a Doc's appointment everyday this week to look at my elbow that has been giving me fits so with chores I didn't get the time to shoot the rifle. It is time to do some load work/press trace testing with the RG3030 across all the appropriate Hodgdon powders I have on hand for the 30-30 Win, eight of them. So this should put some repetitive cycling on the brass through the collet die. I really like that on the first set of cartridges I did not need to expand the case mouth to get the C311-170-RF sized at .310 to seat. I am using a very light Factory Crimp, as light as I can make contact and feel resistance.

I wanted to come back to this topic as I have been working through this but not as quickly as I wanted to move. After a month of delays for various reasons I have started to use the collet die with my Rossi RG3030B Rio Grande. The biggest delay was waiting for delivery of my case annealer and any learning curve that came with its use, lucky, that has been very short. With a week gone for the my son's wedding and being out next week for my daughter's wedding, the only thing running me off the range the last week has been thunderstorm, THANK YOU DEAR LORD FOR ALL EVENTS! So in a nutshell, I'm about two months behind. I did make it out to the range this morning trying to get ahead of the rain but the first two shots out the barrel delivered a bad pressure trace. The strain gage had a bad weld on the barrel so the it was back to the bench. That's 30 bucks down the drain but heavy rain followed and after three years that gets me more excited than the strain gage loss.

strain_gage_loss.jpg

Despite the lack of shooting with this rifle, I have check a couple of things out. Using a Sinclair Runout Gage, I have compared a number of cartridges sized with the Lee Precision Pacesetter Full Length Sizing Die, shot the case, resized it with the Lee Collet Die, seated a Bullet with the Dead Length Bullet Seating Die and then used a factory crimp. I have always thought that the Pacesetter's where outstanding dies and the runout proves it to me at .0005". That is incredibly small. The Collet die cuts the runout in half to almost an unmeasurable .00025"! The measurements are the max seen from the specific points on the case neck. Both of these are outstanding but I would suggest that as runout is concerned, there is really no need to go beyond the standard Pacesetter die set.

sinclair_runout.jpg

My main interest in extending the case life as I have always experienced short case life with my 30-30s and want to see if both neck annealing and the Collet die can help this. I have never bought a 30-30 case, all of my cases are range pickup. That is not quite an accurate description as the have all been picked out of a barrel, the trash barrel to be exact. After opening day of deer season each year, I go out to the gun club and look in the trash barrels. There always about 500 once shot 30-30 cases boxed up real pretty back in their original box and disposed in the bin. Very nice and easy. If asked, I would have said a case lasted 9 to 10 cycles but I never kept good records with these case as they have been plentiful. I have started to keep those records and what precipitated this quest was prove that this is what I was seeing after five max reloads on the once shot cases.

split_neck.jpg

Where I will pick this project up is using annealed cases that are "range pickups", Pacesetter sized, and then once fired from my rifle. From then on, I will continue to anneal the case necks as it takes three minutes for the lot of 50 dedicated to this rifle, and then use the Collet to size. My worry of needing to expand the case mouth for seating my .310" bullet is not an issue. The fit of the collet sized neck is perfect.

I will report back in about a month.