Rossi 30-30 Ackley Improved Load Work
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Rossi 30-30 Ackley Improved Load Work
The four powders that I intend to work with are BL-C(2), H322, H4895, and H-LVR. On Thursday I shot the BL-C(2), the performance was disappointing. MOA was unacceptable, and velocity was missing the forecast by close to 100 FPS! In that this was the first serious shooting I've done after the rechamber, it was an "Oh no" moment. I intended to use the remainder of the 1 lb jug of H-LVR I've had sitting around since that powder was introduced. One thing I have learned about H-LVR is that if BL-C(2) isn't working, neither will H-LVR. So, I will skip igniting primers just to reverifying my experience.
So, looking at H322 and H4895, I decided to give the latter a go as the velocities in the QuickLoad predictions are slightly higher. The incremental loads (51~53 & 61~63) weren't exciting, but velocity was following the forecast. With each of the first two increments, I made turret adjustments, and it brought the evaluation load centered (71 ~ 75). I was able to keep track of all this with the new target camera without going downrange. I did not go through the group size stuff as it only stores it as an image and I would rather record it in the TMT's Precision Records. Shot it all with two minutes between shots.
Here is the load.
MOA was 1.5, so it might be a 225 to 250 yards pronghorn & deer rifle if I can tighten that MOA up just a little bit. I need to let the dogs out and check on my dad, more on that in a little while.
So, looking at H322 and H4895, I decided to give the latter a go as the velocities in the QuickLoad predictions are slightly higher. The incremental loads (51~53 & 61~63) weren't exciting, but velocity was following the forecast. With each of the first two increments, I made turret adjustments, and it brought the evaluation load centered (71 ~ 75). I was able to keep track of all this with the new target camera without going downrange. I did not go through the group size stuff as it only stores it as an image and I would rather record it in the TMT's Precision Records. Shot it all with two minutes between shots.
Here is the load.
MOA was 1.5, so it might be a 225 to 250 yards pronghorn & deer rifle if I can tighten that MOA up just a little bit. I need to let the dogs out and check on my dad, more on that in a little while.
Michael
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Re: Rossi 30-30 Ackley Improved Load Work
Wow. That camera is paying off already. You know exactly what shot where. That looks to be a big savings in time and effort.
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Re: Rossi 30-30 Ackley Improved Load Work
I'm surprised that the group for my max load of H4895 (37.1-grains), shot as good as it did as the velocity stats were awful:
- Average ~ 2496 FPS
- SD ~ 43.39 FPS
- ES ~ 114 FPS
- I dropped the charges using the Deluxe Perfect Powder Measure, so I went out and looked at the stats of 10 drops. The ES was .2-grains (37.0 ~ 37.2). QuickLoad calculates that the difference in the velocities for the given temperature would have been 14 FPS. Would trickling the charges and shooting another ten would be worth the time or components?
- The Speer 130-grain FP (#2007) has a pretty good jump to the bore, .45" .045" to be exact, at the SAAMI Max OAL of 2.550". I'm going to explore that a bit this morning to see what I can get away with. When I took these measurements before the shooting started, I looked at it quickly and could see no wiggle room as the cartridge came off the lifter. I did look at a couple of other 30-30 Win bullets I have on the shelf, and the jump did not get any better. The heavier you go with bullets, the less gain you see from the AI, P. O. Ackley had 125 ~ 130-grain bullets in mind when he worked this improvement.
- With the short brass from fireforming, the bullet is only seated .291" inside the case. I've mentioned it before; I'm a one caliber guy; however, the runout I measured with my Sinclair Concentricity Gauge was nil. My "one caliber" rule of thumb is more about neck tension and the effect that has on the "bomb" inside the case. My brass grew with this cycle on the small lot I think about .005", but I haven't measured an average yet.
- I've always followed the Lee instructions for the Pacesetter dies; shellholder contact plus a quarter turn more. I did back off of these instructions a half turn (1/4 turn off shell holder contact), so the die not interferes with the formed shoulder. That would be .0177" to .0355", but I had a witch of a time chambering the cartridge. Not a shoulder issue but the web. A 336 based action is not going to go boom until all the linkage cams over against the locking block. I had to force these cartridges into the chamber three times to get that lockup so the trigger would engage the hammer. I've adjusted the Pacesetter sizing die back to the instructions, and this issue is resolved. When reaming, I went through great lengths to ensure the Pacesetter die (set up per Lee's instructions), and the chamber mated perfectly so I should have just left things alone and will now.
Michael
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Re: Rossi 30-30 Ackley Improved Load Work
For every .005" the brass grows, I will have to back the charge off .1-grain. The brass will probably never get to 2.039" as I will see what COAL I can get away with while a round is chambered and then let the brass lengthen to were the bullet can be seated at a .308" depth and the case length match up with the bullet's cannelure.Ranch Dog wrote:With the short brass from fireforming, the bullet is only seated .291" inside the case. I've mentioned it before; I'm a one caliber guy; however, the runout I measured with my Sinclair Concentricity Gauge was nil. My "one caliber" rule of thumb is more about neck tension and the effect that has on the "bomb" inside the case. My brass grew with this cycle on the small lot I think about .005", but I haven't measured an average yet.
Michael
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Re: Rossi 30-30 Ackley Improved Load Work
How about that. I can feed and chamber the Speer #2007 at 2.775" 2.575", now I don't have enough brass. Heading back to the room to form a Starline 38-55 Win standard length case through the 30-30 AI to see what I get.
In the meantime, I model all my jacketed bullets in the TMT software. No doubt Speer wanted this bullet seated at .308" plus a crimp. Crimps usually are .015" to .025" in length. Just using the bullet design, all that works out very nicely (.017" crimp length).
In the meantime, I model all my jacketed bullets in the TMT software. No doubt Speer wanted this bullet seated at .308" plus a crimp. Crimps usually are .015" to .025" in length. Just using the bullet design, all that works out very nicely (.017" crimp length).
Michael
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Re: Rossi 30-30 Ackley Improved Load Work
Oops, typo with COAL!Ranch Dog wrote:How about that. I can feed and chamber the Speer #2007 at 2.775" 2.575", now I don't have enough brass. Heading back to the room to form a Starline 38-55 Win standard length case through the 30-30 AI to see what I get.
Michael
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Re: Rossi 30-30 Ackley Improved Load Work
how much was the bullet jump to bore? Was it .45" or 0.045"?
This is very informative, so you know I'm taking notes.
Thanks
jd
This is very informative, so you know I'm taking notes.
Thanks
jd
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There's just some things best left unsaid on the internetsuperhighway.
There's just some things best left unsaid on the internetsuperhighway.
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Re: Rossi 30-30 Ackley Improved Load Work
Thanks, another typo! My fingers are not working this morning.mr surveyor wrote:how much was the bullet jump to bore? Was it .45" or 0.045"?
Michael
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Re: Rossi 30-30 Ackley Improved Load Work
Well, that was a dumb idea. I thought I could send a 38-55 case, trimmed back a bit, through the 35-30 die, the 32 Win Spl die, and then the 30-30 AI die. All you end up is with a really messed up case. Sizing dies are not forming dies.Ranch Dog wrote:How about that. I can feed and chamber the Speer #2007 at 2.775" 2.575", now I don't have enough brass. Heading back to the room to form a Starline 38-55 Win standard length case through the 30-30 AI to see what I get.
I need a 2.040" case. A forming die from CH4D is $57 plus shipping. A cartridge loaded for fireforming cost me 15¢. Hmmmm, with the shipping that takes 500 loads to recover the expense but would eliminate the time to do it.
Michael