I am now Certified! and an Epiphany!

Discussions covering the components and techniques of reloading for your scattergun; be it buckshot, shot, or slugs.

I am now Certified! and an Epiphany!

Postby W.R.Buchanan » 25 May 2019 15

Guys: I am now certified by the State of CA to sell Non Toxic Shotgun slugs for use in CA for hunting.

After 1 July you have to use non lead ammo so shoot any game animal. Period.

I went thru the process and got the certification on my slug which is an STI Sabot with a Brass Insert.

I will be selling these in packs of 5 with 5 brand new Rio Primed Hulls. I can't sell loaded ammo (not FFL) so these with be minus powder and you get to roll crimp them together.

Ranch Dog: These should interest you as you have shot the STI slugs in your Marlin. Since these are the same sabots with a turned brass insert they should be a bit more accurate.

I just had a big Epiphany. Does your Marlin have a 3" chamber? Check it out for a forcing cone?

My Mossberg 500 barrel has a 3" chamber and the forcing cone is about 1/4" long! There is a big square step at the end of the chamber and the 2 3/4" slug has to make the transition between the hull and the Rifling with a 1/4" gap between. There is no taper on the lead of the rifling either, just a square step. This cannot be conducive of accuracy as the slug will get the rifling "CUT" into it while entering with no guarantee that it is centered in the bore since the only thing centering it is the hull. A 3" hull will be a little better as there wouldn't be a gap, but still that short a forcing cone will not produce good accuracy.

This problem could be the reason why you weren't able to get rifle accuracy out of your slug gun. It could also account for not getting any repeatable accuracy from Lee or Lyman Sabot Slugs.

In contrast the Hastings Rifled Barrel for my A5 has about a 1/2-3/4" long forcing cone. Thus it should be more accurate.

Here's some pics of the proposed product.

Randy
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Re: I am now Certified! and an Epiphany!

Postby GasGuzzler » 26 May 2019 02

I recall RD's gun being more accurate with 3" shells than 2-3/4"...so much so I think he abandoned the shorter hulls early in the process. I guess we could just wait and see what he posts.
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Re: I am now Certified! and an Epiphany!

Postby Ranch Dog » 26 May 2019 06

W.R.Buchanan wrote:Guys: I am now certified by the State of CA to sell Non Toxic Shotgun slugs for use in CA for hunting.

After 1 July you have to use non lead ammo so shoot any game animal. Period.

I went thru the process and got the certification on my slug which is an STI Sabot with a Brass Insert.

I will be selling these in packs of 5 with 5 brand new Rio Primed Hulls. I can't sell loaded ammo (not FFL) so these with be minus powder and you get to roll crimp them together.

Congratulations Randy, this is great!

W.R.Buchanan wrote:Ranch Dog: These should interest you as you have shot the STI slugs in your Marlin. Since these are the same sabots with a turned brass insert they should be a bit more accurate.

I think many would like to hear about your business plan for selling the product and pricing.

W.R.Buchanan wrote:I just had a big Epiphany. Does your Marlin have a 3" chamber? Check it out for a forcing cone?

My Mossberg 500 barrel has a 3" chamber and the forcing cone is about 1/4" long! There is a big square step at the end of the chamber and the 2 3/4" slug has to make the transition between the hull and the Rifling with a 1/4" gap between. There is no taper on the lead of the rifling either, just a square step. This cannot be conducive of accuracy as the slug will get the rifling "CUT" into it while entering with no guarantee that it is centered in the bore since the only thing centering it is the hull. A 3" hull will be a little better as there wouldn't be a gap, but still that short a forcing cone will not produce good accuracy.

This problem could be the reason why you weren't able to get rifle accuracy out of your slug gun. It could also account for not getting any repeatable accuracy from Lee or Lyman Sabot Slugs.

In contrast the Hastings Rifled Barrel for my A5 has about a 1/2-3/4" long forcing cone. Thus it should be more accurate.

Here's some pics of the proposed product.

Randy

My 512 is cut to the SAAMI spec as close as can be measured. That is a feature that kind of keeps the 512 at the top of this list for slug guns. I do think that size matters and the Lightfield shooting and mine is that it does.

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What I have found through my shooting, judging the accuracy potential of both lengths (the 3" is better), is that the condition of the hull's mouth after the shot is what tells you whether the group was good or bad before you walk downrange.

As far as the Lee slugs go, until I figure out an easy way to attach tail feathers to keep the projectile stabilized, I don't think the dated design can compete with saboted slugs. More so for the Lyman. I think they are suitable for what they were intended for, short-range work, but slugs guns and hunting with slugs has evolved to something more.

When I return to the slug work, I will be working with the STI and comparing roll crimps between the Lee Load-All II and the MEC Slugger.

Unfortunately, the Marlin is missing out on hog work. My rifles have taken 5 hogs in 10 days, one every other day.
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Re: I am now Certified! and an Epiphany!

Postby W.R.Buchanan » 27 May 2019 17

MIchael: My business plan is to sell these along side my Hand Reloading Press on my Website.
www.buchananprecisionmachine.com

I am selling these as a kit because I don't have an FFL. I can sell components. BPI sells Thug Slug Kits with a slug and new hull, so I figure I can too. I don't see this as being a big seller, but since I am the only maker of Slugs Certified by CA I kind of have a Monopoly. I don't know if that will translate into blockbuster sales but we'll see.

Youtube videos and posting on various gun related sites will be my primary Marketing Strategy. There are also several guys who already have a significant internet presence that I want contact regarding testing my product.. I am also good friends with Brian Pearce of "Handloader and Rifle Magazines." and I talked to him about doing a story on the .73 caliber rifle at the SHOT Show. He is interested in anything bigger than .45 caliber so there is some exposure to be had there. He did the article on my Hand Press in Handloader Magazine, and we have been friends for a few years now.

I have to set up my CNC Lathe to turn these inserts and since I have it up and running I am going to produce some non toxic bullets as well. Probably .45 cal for .45-70's and maybe some smaller calibers as well. Other shops have been doing this here locally and selling some. So we'll see if that can fly along with the Sabot Slugs. I know I have more experience with Boolits than anyone I know of locally so I should be able to produce designs that work well for the intended purpose, which is this state pretty much boils down to small Mule Deer, Wild Pigs and some very expensive to shoot Roosevelt Elk on the Tejon Ranch. $20K for a herd bull sounds almost free,,, doesn't it?!.

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Re: I am now Certified! and an Epiphany!

Postby Ohio3Wheels » 28 May 2019 14

Randy, if you haven't already you might talk to "22Plinkster" over at U-tube he seems up for just about anything.

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Re: I am now Certified! and an Epiphany!

Postby Ranch Dog » 28 May 2019 17

I'm interested in giving them a try, though I enjoy casting my own. Let us know when they are available.
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