Ez-X-Expanders

50 BMG, Collet, and steel reloading dies plus the Factory Crimp Dies. Also, discussions concerning the Deluxe, Pacesetter, and RGB die sets.
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Ez-X-Expanders

Post by Ranch Dog »

[mod="Ranch Dog"]Posts within this topic were copied from another topic so that the information about the Ez-X-Expanders could be kept in a stand alone topic. Please feel free to participate![/mod]
HankRearden wrote:I really think a custom powder through flare die would be best if possible. Would great on the 4 hole turret press as well.
I've been through that and I think flaring the case mouth of a bottle-neck cartridge creates more issues than it solves:
  • The flare induces run-out as the bullet is seated.
  • Slight variances in bullet vs. neck concentricity will buckle the case neck slightly as the bullet seating proceeds.
  • Uniformly removing the flare as or after the bullet is seated is almost impossible to achieve. This results in case necks that are non-concentric or outside of the cartridge specs.
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Re: Ez-X-Expanders

Post by Ranch Dog »

Hank,

I've had expanders on the brain for the last couple of day, heck, the last year. See my post made this evening: Received My Custom 32 Win Spl EZ X Expander
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Re: Ez-X-Expanders

Post by farmerjim »

I have been loading 223 cast on the Lee classic turret Turret using the lyman M die. This requires starting with primed brass. Then the 4 stages on the turret are the M die, Charging die, seating die and the crimp die. 21 grains of H4198 cycles the AR.
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Re: Ez-X-Expanders

Post by Ranch Dog »

farmerjim wrote:I have been loading 223 cast on the Lee classic turret Turret using the lyman M die. This requires starting with primed brass. Then the 4 stages on the turret are the M die, Charging die, seating die and the crimp die. 21 grains of H4198 cycles the AR.
There you go, Hank. Thanks, Jim.

I've been all over the map with my reloading, for 40 years because of time restraints. Since I retired, I have wanted to "define" and "set" all my reloading, so I'm not always reinventing the wheel. The stuff on the Load-Master is getting there quickly, and as I come to each rifle cartridge, I want the same for the turret press. I want to take deprimed, clean, prepped brass and not removed it from the shell holder until it is a completed round of ammo. So that means that sizing and depriming will take place on the press.

I had high hopes for the Auto Drum for powder delivery, but my results with it were downright sorry. I'm sticking with the Perfect Powder Measure mounted on a Long or Short Rifle Charging Die with the Guide Guides Adapter. I have all the Charging Dies on the turrets, that was a big purchase, and today I will set up the Safety Prime.
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Re: Ez-X-Expanders

Post by farmerjim »

If I am loading the 223 with jacketed and the cases have been chamfered, it can be done on the turret in 4 stages with the safety prime. For cast I need a 5 hole turret to do it in one shot.
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Re: Ez-X-Expanders

Post by Ranch Dog »

I'm not working with the 223 Rem; my 22 cartridge is the 218 Bee. I've been using a cast bullet for years, my TLC225-50-RF and I've been using the NOE Expander Plug. I only load this once a year, and I forgot about it with the Custom Expanders.

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There is no way that the stock EZ X Expander, at .222", will allow my .225" cast bullet to sit on the case. It has been at least a dozen years since I've reloaded jacketed bullets with this cartridge, but I went ahead and pulled them out. Both the Hornady and Speer Bee bullets are .224" in diameter, and neither will sit on a case mouth after being sized with the stock EZ X Expander.

By some mistake on my part, I happen to have two NOE .222"~.226" Expander Plugs so I set one up with the Universal Expanding Die for the .224" bullet. Wanting to be .001" over bullet diameter (same + over I use with cast bullets), I carefully measured and marked that point and the point of case contact so that I could use a little bit of math for quick die setup. In under two minutes, the die was ready, and I expanded the case with the .225" portion of the plug. The picture shows the results.

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I do need to order expanders for this family of cartridges; the 218 Bee, 25-20 Win, and 32-20 Win. I did remember why I had not done it yet, the 32-20 Win uses a stock pistol decapper and PTE Die, and I need to talk with the Custom guy and see if I can get a .314" EZ X Expander for the short die body. Right now with this cartridge I'm not using the PTED, but a Short Rifle Charging Die behind the UED with the NOE plug

So this week I'm going to order these EZ X Expanders. Like I noted in my previous post I will order these as a plus size against the stock .222" expander to avoid any confusion.
  • +.003" for .225", I have a thousand jacketed Bee bullets that need to be shot!
  • +.004" for .226" with my TLC225-50-RF
  • .259" for my TLC258-80-RF and the 25-20 Win. I will need to measure the stock expander first.
  • .314" for the TLC313-115-RF and the 32-20 Win (hopefully).
If a fellow was worried about the exact size, you could order .002" over bullet diameter and then sand & polish the expander down so that everything met your expectations. That is something to ponder.

Proof that I'm a full-service Admin! My bench is a mess after pushing my current projects aside and checking this stuff!

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Re: Ez-X-Expanders

Post by HankRearden »

LOL. Dude you and the rest of this forum rock. I really appreciate the feedback.
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Re: Ez-X-Expanders

Post by Ranch Dog »

Don't want to beat the Ez-X-Expander stuff to death but I spent most of the day setting up the various expanders I had custom ordered but yet had not placed in dies. I also ended up ordering a few more, ran Lee out of their oversize stock (probably production positions).

Okay, here are my rules of thumb concerning the Ez-X-Expanders:
  • You must know the "stock" size that comes with the die, pull it and measure it.
  • An Expander for a jacketed bullet needs to be at the diameter of the jacketed bullet. As an example, the 30-30 Win and other .308 sets have a .307" expander, and they produce undersized inside diameters for any .308" bullet I've tried to set on the cartridge. It is not much but if you want a perfect fit order an expander +.001" over the stock size (bullet size of .308" minus expander size of .307" equals .001").
  • For cast bullets, the expander must be +.001" over bullet diameter. For ordering, you must make the same reference to the stock expander as in the previous example.
Most of my shooting is with cast, but I do use some jacketed bullets in my rifle that are 35 caliber and below to establish their accuracy potential. The bottom-line is I'm tired of buttering the bottom of a bullet with beeswax so that I can get it in the case. A couple of years ago, I ordered a bunch of .310" Ez-X-Expanders which the Russian cartridges use these as stock expanders. My intent was to turn them down to .308" and not pay the fee or wait for the custom order. Yeah, right! It only took me two years to do it!

The work took two minutes an expander! I chucked the expander up in the file and put a %@*&$ file to it, these are hard steel, checking it often with a caliper. Once cut, I polished it with 600-grit wet & dry using oil for the "wet." The once.310" expander but now .308" expander went into the die and was locked down. The .308" expander, .001" over the stock part, delivered a perfectly sized inside diameter and the darn bullet sits where it is supposed without tumbling over. I even used long, heavy, flat based bullets in the photo below. There is no way the bullet can remain on the .307" expander case. The .308" expanded case is ready for seating. Jacketed bullets need an Ez-X-Expander that is at the jacketed bullet diameter because brass springs back .0010" to .0015".

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Re: Ez-X-Expanders

Post by Ranch Dog »

As a note, the pin gauges that I'm using to examine the inside diameter of case necks have a very close tolerance, they are "plus" gauges, -.0000"/+.0002".

Another thought I had if you are a bit on the fence when ordering a custom expander is to order it .001" larger than you think you need and work it down. That would be better than getting one too small.

Here are the cartridges that I examined yesterday, it took a long time and a lot of pulling expanders and putting them back in:
  • 218 Bee1
  • 25-20 Win
  • 30-30 Win
  • 300 Sav
  • 308 Win
  • 7.62x39
  • 303 British
  • 32 Win Spl
  • 35 Rem
1 My pin set's smallest diameter is .250" so I could not examine the results of sizing with them. Instead, I used an inside micrometer.
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Re: Ez-X-Expanders

Post by HankRearden »

Ranchdog you made my day. I've been using the same 223 expander with a broken decapper pin for a decade and I have found it impossible to start a bullet. About a month ago I ordered a bunch of replacement parts from Lee and I ordered an expander for the 223. Just for kicks I swapped them today and problem almost solved. The old one measurers 221-222 depending on how hard I squeeze my cheap calipers. The new one is 222 no matter how hard I squeeze(within reason).my bullets are measuring 223-224. I'm guessing this pin was very slightly undersized from day one. I think a slightly oversize one will fix my troubles.
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